Abel to Yzerman
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Digging Friday
by IwoCPO on 11/13/09 at 12:04 PM ET
Comments (30)
Interesting line in the sand drawn between two factions of Wing fans. One side, the majority, is entrenched in the Mike Babcock camp, fully ready to stand by him until our world crumbles. The other side, smaller in number but definitely hockey-smart and persuasive, is eager to separate the coach from any success the team has had. In fact, they’ve opted to claim the Wings succeed in spite of Babcock.
It’s a serious subject, and one you’ll probably find discussed in much greater detail in the comment section here. So, go there now if you’re all lathered up and ready to use big words and stuff.
Me? I found something else to do.
Stop reading. I’m going to tell you now I’m about to rip some Pens fans. All of them? No. There are some good ones and we’ve pointed them out in the past. But I’ll tell you what, for the dicks? I’ve still got unfinished business and my summer-time agenda has extended to the Fall. Don’t like it. Don’t read.
What happens when you’re fans of the reigning champs and your team starts to suck and you’re too embarrassed to go back to the opposing team’s blogs because you just don’t have much to say when your precious little Pens are bending over for any team crosses their path? It was so easy over the summer to point to Detroit’s economic problems. It was just a piece of cake to discuss the auto industry and use it as a punch line while hundreds of thousands of Americans were out of work. Funny stuff. Soooo cold in the D, wasn’t it?
Well, it’s warming up now ain’t it? And while the temps start to rise (metaphor) along with Detroit’s winning percentage? The genius Pens fans are finding a creative way to cope with the sudden demise of their one-trick champs.
Over at Letgopens.com (and believe me, they’re epic A2Y fans over there), they’ve devised a nifty plan to help their boys get on the right track…a series of images that really speaks to the heart of who the Pens are as an organ-I-zation.
Oh, there’s plenty more. Plenty. As many pictures as there were comments made here over the summer about the humorous plight of unemployed Michigan residents? Not quite. But lots of ‘em to see. Highly recommend you stop over for a visit.
Hard to follow up brilliance like that, but try we will…and we’re going to do so by pointing you to a few new Wing blogs I’ve been delinquent in recognizing.
We talked about Below the Crossbar yesterday. Here’s a ditty from their post-Canuck review.
Seriously, Jimmy Howard was above average in net. On a night when the team needed some serious goaltending because they did not show up, Jimmy gave them the stops they needed. Being outshot 15-5 in the first, and 26-12 at the worst point, the Red Wings needed a big-time game from the goalie, and Jimmy delivered. Congrats to him on two well played games. I am more at ease with our backup situation. I want to see this a few more times still though before I completely feel at ease.
I was so physically excited to discuss our Uncle this morning that I completely neglected our boy Jimmah’s performance.
Yes. Awesome. Noted.
Still. Not. Convinced. I think Howard’s been great the last two games. Good to see and I stand by my prediction that the Wings will win the Jennings. He’ll do what a backup should, at least one for a good team. He’s gonna win 70 percent of his starts and that’s a good spell for Osgood. Nothing will be expected of him in the playoffs. He’ll never, not once, see postseason ice. Not this year. Maybe never. I hope Jimmy Howard does well, but I keep going back to what is consistently said about him by the Salers and whoever else has watched him in GR. This is not a guy who reeks of sustained superior performance. In fact, I gave it a brief look today. Over his last two seasons, he did what he’s accomplished the last two games (consecutive 1 goal or less performances) twice. In two years.
He’s playing well. Good. We need him to. I’m holding off on the coronation for now, though.
Ellen at The Big Red Machine made a casual observation this morning about something you guys aptly addressed in last night’s Live Blog.
Gord Dwyer and Dave Jackson had a field day calling weak penalties against Detroit in the 2nd. Conversely, Vancouver only got tagged for 3 minors, even though I saw several plays for which Detroit was called. Totally weak.
The call that stands out, of course, was the high sticking penalty against Stuart…the one that was called by the center ice official when his partner was ten feet away with his arm down. The “high stick”, of course, was actually William Tell blasting a teammate across the neck with his shaft. Might sound pleasant to a Dive fan. But disgusting to watch that scenario play out, and still one of the most frustrating aspects of our sport. Why, when you know the closer ref saw the play, can’t he let the idiot at center ice know he’d boned the call?
I’m in the Unibomber’s corner. I am. I have been and I’ll stay there. I think he looks better than many expected and I’m kinda convinced that, sooner or later, he’s going to start popping a few. Rob at The Production Line agrees. I think.
So far this season, Bertuzzi has looked OK. He hasn’t looked looked like an elite scorer…or even close to it. That goal against the BJ’s…even if it went in…was ugly as sin. But watching him this week and during the Bruins game, I noticed one thing a lot of people didn’t expect - he’s hustling. To me, that’s a sign he’s buying into the system. He’s been the first man down on the forecheck a handful of times and I noticed him humping it on the backcheck as well.
There. Branch out bitches. There’s more to read than A2Y and whatever elitist literature discussion you guys had yesterday when you thought I wasn’t looking.
And don’t forget. Every Cup champ needs bling. It’s a new law.
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Comments
The “high stick”, of course, was actually William Tell blasting a teammate across the neck with his shaft. Might sound pleasant to a Dive fan.
Hahahaha they really do enjoy that.
Posted by Nathan from the scoresheet! on 11/13/09 at 12:17 PM ET
I was so physically excited to discuss our Uncle this morning that I completely neglected our boy Jimmah’s performance.
And here I was thinking you were physically excited from giving your boss footrubs all week.
Jimmah was solid, but this was only two games of solid play. I am still in wait-and-see mode, although I will give him props, Jimmah was our best player last night.
Posted by VooX from Behind the Bar in the Hasek Club Car on 11/13/09 at 12:28 PM ET
At least the Wings win one that Vancouver probably earned on the ice. So often it goes the other way. I don’t recall Jimmah making fantastic, stop-your-masturbating-and-watch-the-replay saves, but he was very solid and more.
Tough break for Vancouver not to get a single point from that effort. Come April the gap in the Western Conference from #1 to #12 may be only 15 to 18 points. A bunch of teams headed to 95 points will be going thru emotional roller coasters night by night the last two weeks of the season.
Posted by RWBill from the Land of 12 in 12. on 11/13/09 at 12:36 PM ET
It’s the nature of coaching—coaches get too much credit when their teams win, and WAY too much of the punishment when their teams lose.
The way this team has turned around a poor start to the season is great. The players, first and foremost, deserve credit. Coaches are secondary, but still deserve credit. After all, they are a part of the team.
If Babcock didn’t have three finals appearances under his belt, a Cup ring, and a whole case of 50-win seasons, I wouldn’t be so quick to praise him for getting this team righted. But the bottom line is that, like Kenny Holland, Babcock has a track record that deserves respect. We all know there was a shit-ton of luck involved in the drafting of Zetterberg, Datsyuk, Franzen, Ericsson, etc. etc. etc. We also know there were a lot of shrewd movements and gestures that helped take advantage of said luck, or cultivate it. The same can be said of Babcock.
Yes, Babcock played Jimmah in back-to-backs, and dropped Drew Miller into the fire because he HAD to. But he also said the right things to the press while the team was going slow. He said the right things in the off-season to let his team know that their outlook on the game was going to have to change to continue winning hockey games. The last two years in the finals, he said all the right things, didn’t whine and complain about officiating, or any of that nonsense (all the while Michelle was crying about everything in his pressers). Because Babcock has done so many concrete things correctly in the past, it’s only fair to give him some credit when luck reaches up and hands him a smart coaching decision. He’s earned that respect through success and productivity.
Put it like this—none of us know what exactly goes on in the locker room. We don’t know what goes on in Uncle Mike’s office. We don’t know what video he watches, what notes he takes, how he communicates with his advance scouts, how he delegates to his assistants, or how he takes his coffee. We don’t know how he runs his drills. We don’t know what he says between periods when the Wings are playing great, or when they’re dropping a stinker. And we’re never going to know these things.
What we DO know is that Dave Lewis inherited a team that, while transitioning, still had more talent than any club in hockey. And we know that while Lewis was able to win regular season games, we also know that regardless of what he was doing, it wasn’t translating to winning playoff games.
Uncle Mike takes over, and learns hard in his first season what it’s like being the coach of the Red Wings. The pressure, the expectations, the veterans… all things he never had at any other stage in his coaching career. He had to adapt and change. And sure enough, in his second season, he gets the team a bad injury away from going to the Cup finals. Next season, he wins it all. Next season, he goes to game seven for the trophy.
Something changed. We can’t put our fingers on it, simply because we don’t have the inside information that would be required to do so. But we know that the results changed when Babcock took over for Lewis. That change is all I need to know.
Again, don’t get me wrong—the players always deserve the lion’s share of the credit. After all, they’re the ones the execute. But Mike Babcock has earned his praise through a track record of excellence, especially at the helm of the Winged Wheel.
Posted by Nathan from the scoresheet! on 11/13/09 at 12:40 PM ET
I don’t recall Jimmah making fantastic, stop-your-masturbating-and-watch-the-replay saves, but he was very solid and more.
Fair enough, but how often do you really have those pants-tightening saves league-wide?
For me, a handful of times per week. So I am content to enjoy Jimmah shutting down Vancouver’s quality chances with very solid positioning and puck awareness.
Besides, I was thinking last night, who better for Jimmah to learn consistency from than Ozzie, one of the mentally toughest goalies I have ever seen play? Consistency is a mental game if you have the talent.
And Ozzie helping Jimmah along will help his mental game, hopefully, in a significant way. Maybe the mental edge is all Jimmah needs to become a true NHL starter.
Posted by VooX from Behind the Bar in the Hasek Club Car on 11/13/09 at 12:42 PM ET
DET 17 GP, 9-5-3, 21 pts.
My terrible math skills lead me to believe DET has played a hair over 20% of their games (.207).
Roughly translates into 105 pts at their current pace. Not too shabby, given their horrendous start.
Posted by Jeff OKWingnut from Quest for 12 on 11/13/09 at 12:47 PM ET
Jimmy did get help last night. There were spurts where Wings blocked a lot of shots (especally on the PK). To be honest, the Wings haven’t blocked a whole lot of shots lately, they always seem to get through.
Jimmy fought his way through though and obviously it’s too early to tell the end result… however I have to say that his performance last night should have ended any “He definitely has no future!” talk. It cemented the fact that we still don’t know either way.
And to any of the 19 that thinks they now how goalies develop… when was the last time we actually watched the Wings develop a promising goalie and bring him on up? It’s not like we have a whole lot of experience at this thing as fans watching even… so we’re pretty clueless how this all works. Jimmy’s honestly something NEW for us.
Posted by Primis on 11/13/09 at 12:51 PM ET
Something changed
.Posted by Nathan from Jonny Ericsson’s ice cream truck on 11/13/09 at 12:40 PM ET
Two things changed. Hossa and McCrimmon. Big changes. As much as I liked the Hossa signing, to me, it upset the chemistry on the Cup winning squad.
We went out and got a player that we really didn’t need. We all know how well McCrimmon is working out.
Lets Go Red Wings!!!!!
Posted by Kate from Pa.-made in Detroit on 11/13/09 at 12:57 PM ET
Jesus Effing Christ, those Pen(i)s fans are REALLY wandering off the map now…that whole page has to be one of the most twisted things I’ve ever seen (that’s not pornographic)...
Posted by Animal Drew from A Nightmare on Helm Street on 11/13/09 at 01:07 PM ET
Drew -
Seen PensBlog? They won’t even really talk or post about games anymore. Instead they’ve taken to posting highlight clips from Wilkes-Barre Scranton games and rambling on about child molestation in Jurassic Park.
Posted by Primis on 11/13/09 at 01:14 PM ET
The Stanley Cup may not matter, but if MIke Babcock wins an Olympic gold medal for Canada he WILL get the Adams Trophy!
................The Canadian press has spoken…....................
Posted by w2j2 on 11/13/09 at 01:15 PM ET
Chief, the homos over at Pen(i)sblog have completely lost their shit. If you think sparkles was bad… Check this out
Warning: Not safe for work, nor anyone who has an opposable thumb
Posted by VooX from Behind the Bar in the Hasek Club Car on 11/13/09 at 01:19 PM ET
Posted by Primis on 11/13/09 at 01:14 PM ET
Sorry Primis, didn’t see your post as I hadn’t refreshed the page when I posted my link… still… I hate Pen(i)s fans, they are such bandwagon bitches.
I can’t wait for a couple of years down the road when the cap bites them in the ass, and they still aren’t tanking for draft picks. Pens fans will be perpetually crying and cutting themselves. And I will be providing them with sharp razor blades to do it.
The Pens fans’ gene pool needs some chlorine.
Posted by VooX from Behind the Bar in the Hasek Club Car on 11/13/09 at 01:21 PM ET
All coaches, in all sports (except maybe football) are unfairly judged.
Phil Jackson is the best NBA coach ever because he had Jordan, Shaq and Kobe carrying his teams. Joe Girardi gets burned by Burnett sucking at three days rest (but praised for playing Sabbathia and Pettite on the same situation), Dunga (Brazilian soccer coach) is praised for winning but criticized for playing ugly. It doesn’t make sense, and it doesn’t matter.
Posted by Guilherme from Brazsil on 11/13/09 at 01:27 PM ET
Making Blingees is fun.
Posted by WingsFanInBeanLand from Lidstrom's head telling him 1 more year on 11/13/09 at 01:51 PM ET
Chief, the homos over at Pen(i)sblog have completely lost their shit. If you think sparkles was bad… Check this out
Warning: Not safe for work, nor anyone who has an opposable thumb
Posted by VooX from Behind the Bar in the Hasek Club Car on 11/13/09 at 01:19 PM ET
That is truely one of the saddest, stupidest things I have ever seen on the Gore.
Or any place else, for that matter.
After the first 3 or 4 slides, I didn’t waste any more of my time.
Very sad.
Very, very sad
What does that really have to do with hockey? With any thing?
Maybe it’s me but I just don’t get it.
Posted by stonehands-78 from the beginning ... a WingsFan, on 11/13/09 at 02:15 PM ET
“But disgusting to watch that scenario play out, and still one of the most frustrating aspects of our sport. Why, when you know the closer ref saw the play, can’t he let the idiot at center ice know he’d boned the call? “
That’s one of the things I like about the NFL. If there’s a penalty called, the refs get together and talk before announcing the penalty to the crowd. If they decide there actually WASN’T a penatly, they pick up the flag. I think that’s something the NHL should look into. But of course, if it makes sense, it ain’t happenin’.
Posted by Chris in Hockey Hell from COLUMBIA, TENNESSEE on 11/13/09 at 03:01 PM ET
You nailed it about Howard: the only meaningful success is consistent success, and until Howard has some of that, I’m a doubter.
You’re right about Bertuzzi, too. He’s been downright unimpressive on the power play, but he’s got as many even strength scoring chances as any other Wing forward—and not all of them were gifts from Datsyuk, either. He hasn’t been a disaster defensively, and in fact has even been good at times. I think he’s exceeded any reasonable set of expectations. If you’re disappointed with him, I think you’re focusing too much on goals and not enough on scoring chances. Chances always turn into goals, sooner or later.
Posted by Ryan from Toronto on 11/13/09 at 04:07 PM ET
Well I guess I can reset….err…..continue to keep my Tuesdays until A2Y mentions the Pens at 0. That’s what, 3 or 4 posts with Pens mentions this week alone. You’d think it was May/June 2010 already.
Posted by Standard A2Y Fare on 11/13/09 at 04:29 PM ET
And oh IwoCPO, I can’t seem to recall the post where we discussed the inevitable compliment that will come from Babcock regarding Crosby’s leadership, but that ever-increasing chorus calling for him to get that C on his Canada jersey come Vancouver is only a prelude to the inevitable. Namely, “Uncle Mike”, a microphone, and him telling the world how impressed he is with Crosby, his leadership, and the mental/intangible aspects of his game. There are about 7 or 8 Tuesdays until that happens, so enjoy them while they last.
Posted by Standard A2Y Fare on 11/13/09 at 04:35 PM ET
Two requests from a Pens fan:
1) Don’t judge Pens fans based off of the Pensblog.
2) Feel free to rip apart that site you posted up there. That is the most embarrassing thing I have ever seen in my life.
One thing about the Pensblog, though: They aren’t afraid to call out the bandwagon fans who mysteriously showed up after the lockout. Even though I am positive that half of the people who post there fit into that description.
Posted by Link_Gaetz on 11/13/09 at 04:42 PM ET
that ever-increasing chorus calling for him to get that C on his Canada jersey come Vancouver
Bwahahahaha!!! Too damn funny. Sorry, but in MY Canada, you know the real one and not the fictitious Canada you pulled out of your ass, there is no chorus… and certainly no crescendo… for Rosby to have the C in Vancouver.
In fact every knowledgable Canadian hockey fan I’ve spoken to (the real not fictitious fans) are behind either Iginla or Scott Niedermeyer to be the Captain. You know them, they have actual leadership abilities and respect from their colleagues. Unlike the league’s whiniest player, Rosby.
And BTW, among your Golden Shower posts at Pen(i)sblog, the today’s post featured a video of last year’s SCF. Some people are really clinging to past glories. But you wouldn’t know, once the Pens start losing you little girls get sand in your vaginas and don’t want to talk about hockey. Or to games until the next tanktacular rebuild.
Posted by VooX from Behind the Bar in the Hasek Club Car on 11/13/09 at 04:59 PM ET
Bwahahahaha!!! Too damn funny. Sorry, but in MY Canada, you know the real one and not the fictitious Canada you pulled out of your ass, there is no chorus… and certainly no crescendo… for Rosby to have the C in Vancouver.
You’re right. I mean, I can only think of one Order of Canada, Stanley Cup winning, former Canadian National Team GM who thinks Crosby should be named C:
http://tsn.ca/nhl/story/?id=297234
Is he not Canadian anymore? Does he not count? I presume you are familiar with TSN?
Come on. If you want to make an argument for Niedermayer or Iginla, go for it. There is plenty of merit to both (in fact, if it were my decison, it would go to Niedermayer; but I’m kind of old-fashioned that way). Do you want me to dredge up more articles with prominent names supprting his candidacy?
Look, I know Game 7 still hurts (hell I still get upset about 07-08). But if you want to talk hockey, take of your Wings shades, and face reality—there is a very real chance that Crosby will have a letter on his sweater come Vancouver time, and Uncle Mike is going to LOVE him. Sorry, but that’s the way it is.
Posted by Standard A2Y Fare on 11/13/09 at 05:14 PM ET
You’re right. I mean, I can only think of one Order of Canada, Stanley Cup winning, former Canadian National Team GM who thinks Crosby should be named C:
http://tsn.ca/nhl/story/?id=297234
Is he not Canadian anymore? Does he not count? I presume you are familiar with TSN?
Bwahahahaha!!! x2
So you’re going to put all that weight behind what Bobby Clarke said, stupid fool. Let’s examine his record:
-His most notable accomplishment is breaking Kharlamov’s ankle in the ‘72 Summit Series.
-He GM’d Team Canada to a fourth place Olympic finish, making Eric Lindros captain. Let me repeat that, he made Lindros captain choosing him over such no-name players like: Gretzky, Yzerman, Bourque, Foote, and Nieuwendyk.
-He GM’d his own talent-laden team to a first round playoff exit four out of five seasons
-He said this about his coach Roger Neilson who contracted cancer and was replaced:
The Neilson situation - Roger got cancer - that wasn’t our fault. We didn’t tell him to go get cancer. It’s too bad that he did. We feel sorry for him, but then he went goofy on us.
Now let’s look at the panel you so proudly point to as a “Chorus of Canadians”. We have Bob MacKenzie. Great, knows his hockey. WIth Bob Clarke and Keith Jones, who… well… they’ve got Bob MacKenzie.
Let’s review Tweedledee’s and Tweedledum’s opinions in that article compared to Bob MacKenzie.
Q:Who should be Team Canada’ captain at the Olympics - Sidney Crosby, Jarome Iginla or Scott Niedermayer?
BC/KJ - Rosby
Bobby Mac- Niedermeyer
Bobby Mac is more in touch with Canadians and hockey, the others offer pathetic reasons for Rosby. You’ll disagree, but you’re an idiot.
Question #3: Will Peter Forsberg, who is mounting a comeback in Sweden, make it all the way back to the NHL this season?
BC/KJ - Yes
Bobby Mac - No
Anyone who has followed Forsberg’s foot troubles know his days are done. Score another one for Bobby Mac
Of course you may mistake Jones and Clarke for great hockey minds. Those of us who know hockey certainly won’t. I’ll stick with Bob MacKenzie on this debate, he’s the only one who doesn’t sniff glue on the panel.
Posted by VooX from Behind the Bar in the Hasek Club Car on 11/13/09 at 05:51 PM ET
It doesn’t matter who is captain of Team Canada if Boudreau has his way and Mike Green is one of the first pairing defensemen.
And it seems like more people are of the mind that Crosby should concentrate on playing and not be distracted by the incredible demands that the captain of the team will have - especially if they lose (see: Mike Green as first pairing defenseman).
Posted by Baroque from Michigan on 11/13/09 at 06:09 PM ET
The “high stick”, of course, was actually William Tell blasting a teammate across the neck with his shaft. Might sound pleasant to a Dive fan.
That’s just great writing. I spat chewed up M&M’s all over my cat’s face when I read that.
Great work. Plus 80.
Posted by Sullyosis from A hateful lair in Post Apocalyptic US (or Arizona) on 11/13/09 at 06:39 PM ET
@Voox:
Congratulations. You have constructed a number of strawmen, knocked them down ably, and now stare proudly at your work.
Look you dont have to agree with them. That’s fine. My post was in response to your suggestion that Crosby is now viewed as a potential Captain. I posted a link that indicates from TSN that indicates otherwise. As I said in my initial post, I DONT EVEN AGREE WITH THEM. But you conveniently ignored that so you could post your rambling diatribe. Excellent.
Also guess what—Bobby Clarke knows more about hockey than you. Shocking I know. But hey, that dude on the internet with the danglium avatar said otherwise, so clearly what does he know. And this is from someone who has reveled in Clarke’s failures over the years, as a fan of his archrivals.
Ill just look forward to the day when Crosby gets that C or A on his jersey, secure in the knowledge that it will have ruined your day.
Posted by Standard A2Y Fare on 11/13/09 at 07:10 PM ET
Congratulations. You have constructed a number of strawmen, knocked them down ably, and now stare proudly at your work.
Look you dont have to agree with them. That’s fine. My post was in response to your suggestion that Crosby is now viewed as a potential Captain. I posted a link that indicates from TSN that indicates otherwise. As I said in my initial post, I DONT EVEN AGREE WITH THEM. But you conveniently ignored that so you could post your rambling diatribe. Excellent.
Actually, I disputed your claim that an “ever-increasing chorus” in Canada is “calling for him to get that C on his Canada jersey” by stating that “every knowledgable Canadian hockey fan I’ve spoken to… are behind either Iginla or Scott Niedermeyer to be the Captain”.
Your counter was Bobby Clarke’s opinion, and so I happened to show some of his great decisions in the past that make me feel he isn’t that hockey savvy. Including some current ones.
He’s the guy that made Eric Lindros captain of a woefully underachieving Team Canada. A perfect choice to listen to this time around.
So pretend I’ve distorted the argument, but I haven’t. There is no chorus and Bobby Clark is not knowledgable about hockey, as I see it. (Peter Forsberg is coming back to the NHL. Bank on it.)
And I will contend that for every one expert you find saying Rosby should be captain, you’ll find ten experts saying he shouldn’t be captain.
But I’d still love to see proof of this “ever-increasing chorus” of Canadians you speak of. Make sure they’re knowledgeable, we don’t listen to proven morons like Dater and the Douche Canoe around here.
Posted by VooX from Behind the Bar in the Hasek Club Car on 11/13/09 at 09:08 PM ET
Oh yeah I get it, it’s Friday the 13th.
Posted by Lindas1st from New England on 11/13/09 at 09:40 PM ET
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Posted by J.J. from Kansas on 11/13/09 at 12:09 PM ET