thanks to the usual exceptional drafting by Detroit, leaving them so deep into Grand Rapids that they can afford to rotate out the lower-tier players as their salaries climb and replace them with cheaper and just-as-effective young players, they can keep the core together and keep the superstars who just want to win win win - and will do exactly that for a decade to come.

assuming Hossa signs, look at the core they’d have together.  it’s beyond amazing.  it’s unfathomable in a salary cap world.  that being said, what’s one of the biggest contracts coming to its end?  Ken Holland.

would a GM leave with a team like this still in place that he himself has built?  or would he wait until the writing is on the wall and it’s all about to fall apart?

if he would only leave under the second set of conditions, that means Ken Holland will be GM of the Red Wings into his grave.  the way he is handling things, and how they draft, the danger of it all falling apart isn’t even a spec of light at the end of the tunnel.

I thought the 90s were a great time to be a Wings fan, and it was.  but so were the 00s.  and so will be the 10s.

Posted by PaulinMiamiBeach on 04/12/09 at 10:50 AM ET

Hah, nice job pulling that Matheson bit out of context.  When he writes “Hossa is going nowhere”, what he means is that Holland will have time to negotiate a deal with Hossa after the playoffs.  Not that Hossa is going to stay in Detroit.

Posted by Ryan from Toronto on 04/12/09 at 11:03 AM ET

I’ve noticed that, like the Zetterberg deal, the non-Wings fans who seem to be the most upset about this are also the ones who think the deals are huge mistakes by the Red Wings.

That would seem contradictory, but the mind of the Wing-hater isn’t driven by logic, I suppose,

Posted by Mandingo from The Garage on 04/12/09 at 11:04 AM ET

This is about as black and white as it gets, Ryan:

I will tell you this: despite what people are saying, the salary cap in Detroit will definitely be no impediment to Marian signing there,” said Winter

If there’s any room for confusion there I’d say it’s Winter hinting that if Hossa does leave Detroit, it’s for a non-Cap related reason.

Posted by IwoCPO from Sunny San Diego, bitches on 04/12/09 at 11:06 AM ET

The most disgusting thing about this debate is that it puts me in the position of siding with Mike Milbury and Gary Bettman… and that sucks.

Posted by HockeyinHD on 04/12/09 at 11:09 AM ET

Happy Easter, everyone - sorry I will miss the liveblog this afternoon (too busy).  Afternoon games are just plain annoying.

First, this was the CBA the owners decided they NEEDED to have so badly they were willing to lock out the players for a year.  It is designed according to their specifications and to meet their requirements.  They could have eliminated any malipulations involving the salary cap by making the cap hit in a given year equal to the salary that year, instead of the average salary over the entire length of the contract.  It would have made a great deal of sense, and no one would have argued against the logic of it.  They didn’t.

Any loopholes are there because they wanted them.  The loopholes were left, I believe, because the teams wanted to make sure that they would have the opportunity to take advantage of them and give themselves an edge over the other teams that weren’t as smart.

If they are ticked off now, it’s because someone else is taking advantage of the loopholes before they could - or doing a better job of it than they have managed to so far.  If they are jealous, then tough.  I’ll send them some cheese to go along with the fine whine. 

(And second, Milbury can bite me.  Why anyone gives that incompetent primate’s opinion on anything hockey-related more than the merest iota of notice - and that only to avoid doing the same thing he has done - is beyond me.  There is a reason the man has a job as a talking head, and that is because he failed at anything other than talking (and he isn’t all that good at that either, actually).)

What a toolbox.

Posted by Baroque from Michigan on 04/12/09 at 11:10 AM ET

Some are already claiming Holland has violated the “spirit of the Cap.” Those comments can be found here.

Excuse me for sounding like a real douche for a second, but I have to say it—the cap violates the spirit of America, so cram it up your douche-holes, critics.

And at this point, I can’t even worry about what happens with Hossa. Franzen for under $4 million makes my pants tighter. Even if Hossa goes, the Wings will keep Hudler and then likely go out and find the Drake-style veteran they need.

Posted by Nathan from Jonny Ericsson's ice cream truck on 04/12/09 at 11:16 AM ET

It takes two parties to agree to a contract, and all contracts are signed within the rules of the CBA.  So where’s the problem?

The hypocrisy surrounding all the criticism of this deal is mind-boggling.

Posted by Incognetis from Delaware... Hi... I'm in... Delaware on 04/12/09 at 11:20 AM ET

Franzen for under $4 million makes my pants tighter.

And that made me laugh out loud.

Posted by Incognetis from Delaware... Hi... I'm in... Delaware on 04/12/09 at 11:20 AM ET

Any loopholes are there because they wanted them.

See, I don’t think that’s the case.  It implies that Bettman and the NHL are precipient enough to be able to forecast out five or more years and anticipate how teams will react to the cap… and I can’t possibly give him that much credit.

I think these loopholes are there because the cap is a brand new mechanic, and as a hard cap is specific and unique to the NHL.  It was impossible to foresee every possible reaction and strategy to cirumventing the cap.  Holland, one of the brightest GMs in the league, didn’t employ the tactic of running contracts out 10+ years and frontloading the money with Datsyuk just two years ago.  Why not?

I think this loophole will be gone shortly.

Posted by HockeyinHD on 04/12/09 at 11:23 AM ET

Heh.  “Spirit of The Cap.” Blow me.  The NHL is about rules and regulations.  HOCKEY is about spirit and passion.  Hockey doesn’t need the NHL, but the reverse isn’t true.

At this point, Hossa would be a bonus, but only if we can keep some of the up-and-comers.  Perhaps one year at $1 or 2 million, then break the bank when Nick takes a pay cut?  That has the potential to go south on us real quick if things turn sour between Hossa and the Wings (yeah, that’s likely) and we say goodbye after only two years.  Or it works out pretty damn good.  Hrm.  However, isn’t this the same time of year he was saying conciliatory things to the Penguins as well?  A bit of caution here might be advised.

That being said, Ritch Winter NEVER said those same things last year.  WTF, Hossa may just be as good as extended, or he may be sick of the slacking and is gone if this team doesn’t go all the way.

So if he stays?  We keep Hossa.  If he goes?  We keep Franzen and Hudler and Leino and…

Win/Win.  Bitches.

“Spirit of The Cap.” Excuse me white I go write that in the sky and then shoot the crap out of it with a shotgun.

Posted by AndrewFromAnnArbor from the in-laws' on 04/12/09 at 11:28 AM ET

“Spirit of the cap” makes me giggle, too.

In any business agreement such as the CBA, if you rely on unwritten rules, you’re an idiot.  The only way to make unwritten rules binding is to write them down in the first place.  It’s the same principle as wills, medical powers of attorney, DNRs and prenups - if it’s in writing, it minimizes the possibility of misunderstanding later on because the two parties had different expectations.

If the owners didn’t want cap manipulation, they should have put it in writing.  They had long enough to put together the damn thing.

Posted by Baroque from Michigan on 04/12/09 at 11:28 AM ET

So, since baseball didn’t have rules about Setroids in the game in the 90’s...?

Posted by HockeyinHD on 04/12/09 at 11:32 AM ET

Or, Steroids even.

Posted by HockeyinHD on 04/12/09 at 11:33 AM ET

So, since baseball didn’t have rules about Setroids in the game in the 90’s...?

Oh. Right. Good point. 

Memo to Gary: please begin the movement to force the Detroit Red Wings to forfeit any games won post-CBA.  We’re pretty sure, despite the fact that there is nothing in writing prohibiting anything they’ve done, that they violated “the spirit of the salary cap.”

Short of that?  Give us an asterisk for last year please.

Posted by IwoCPO from Sunny San Diego, bitches on 04/12/09 at 11:36 AM ET

I may have to watch the game on NBC now just to see what the Douche Canoe and company will say…

That makes me smile and grimace at the same time.

To the rest of the league waking up and dusting off their clubs- Happy Easter, Bitches (exclamation point)

Posted by mrfluffy from Cincy on 04/12/09 at 11:36 AM ET

Once that loophole is closed, the teams will find another one.  It’s the best way to gain an advantage over other teams - just plain spending more is now eliminated as a tactic, so smarts and sneakiness is going to be used to gain any advantage possible.

Any GM who doesn’t do anything within his power to improve his team is going to be out of a job, and no one is going to care that he didn’t violate the spirit of the CBA - the only thing that matters is that he didn’t win.  That’s it.

Posted by Baroque from Michigan on 04/12/09 at 11:37 AM ET

Chief, my gut feeling is that the Wings and Hossa have the foundation of a deal in place, and when the cap number comes out, they’ll do some tweaking.

Remember what Khan! posted (italics mine):

Because of salary cap rules, Holland could sign Franzen or Marian Hossa, but not both, before the end of the season. He will resume talks with Hossa’s agent after the playoffs.

“I wanted to get one guy signed to a contract that I felt good about, and it turned out it was Johan,” Holland said. “I told Marian and his agent we’ll see what the cap number is. My first priority would be to figure out a way to keep him. We’ll see what the future brings.”

Posted by George James Malik from South Lyon, MI on 04/12/09 at 11:39 AM ET

Chief, my gut feeling is that the Wings and Hossa have the foundation of a deal in place, and when the cap number comes out, they’ll do some tweaking.

Morning George. My concern about that is a concern I don’t even want to mention but will.  If the Wings lose early, will he still stay?  I believe he will. But it’s a two-layered vomit inducer that I can’t get out of my mind.

Posted by IwoCPO from Sunny San Diego, bitches on 04/12/09 at 11:41 AM ET

Regardless of what I’ve said in the past...anyone else still get kinda queasy when you think about some of the players the Wings would have to let go of to keep Hoss?

Posted by mrfluffy from Cincy on 04/12/09 at 11:48 AM ET

So, Ken Holland lawyers are smarter than the NHL’s lawyers.

I’m supposed to have a problem with that? If the NHL had any sense at all, they would make sure that they hire Hollands lawyers to write the next CBA,

Until then, STFU, and deal with it.

Always said I’d rather have a brilliant lawyer, and an average doctor, than vice versa.

Posted by dougie on 04/12/09 at 11:50 AM ET

A bit of tunnel vision here.

Still not clear who is taking advantage?

The team?
or
The player?

Posted by HockeyTownTodd from A. K. A. NostraGrampus on 04/12/09 at 11:51 AM ET

It was impossible to foresee every possible reaction and strategy to cirumventing the cap.

foresee EVERY possible reaction?  sure, that’s not possible.  but to forsee THIS ONE reaction - spreading salaries over many years to bring the cap hit down - was definitely foreseeable.

Posted by PaulinMiamiBeach on 04/12/09 at 11:52 AM ET

So what exactly is the “spirit of the cap”? To make a 2 year run at the cup and then return to the depths of mediocrity so that someone else gets a shot? Well F that. We’re the Detroit Red Wings. You saddled us with this BS cap because you over-expanded and had to compensate the Bubbas and now the Dives of the league.

Is it our fault that the we have built a classy organization where everyone is given their due respect? Is it our fault that we have an organization that’s built around winning silver hardware? Why yes it is. It’s certainly not the NHL’s fault.

“Spirit of the cap” is just a spin word created by those in the hockey media who want to yell “no fair”. To hell with them. Number 12 is for you assholes.

Posted by bobby lang from The Ohio State University on 04/12/09 at 11:56 AM ET

I’ve noticed that, like the Zetterberg deal, the non-Wings fans who seem to be the most upset about this are also the ones who think the deals are huge mistakes by the Red Wings.

That would seem contradictory, but the mind of the Wing-hater isn’t driven by logic, I suppose,

They’re just using that as a reason to criticize the wings.  No one wants to appear as overly jealous as BBB fans, so they play it cool and try to seem like it’s out of concern for the Wing’s best interests they’re shaking their head over the deal.

“It’s not me, it’s you...”, applied to Hockey, if you will.

Posted by shanetx on 04/12/09 at 11:58 AM ET

I’ve never been silent about this and I’ll repeat it now.  I don’t care what the rest of the league thinks, what other fans think, what the MSM or other teams’ bloggers think.  In fact I’ll go further: if it irritates all of the above?  Good. 

Welcome Evil Drew to our world.

It could be read another way.  Like, “If Marian Hossa decides not to stay in Detroit, it won’t be because of the salary cap.”

I’m just sayin’. 

Chief you are like the mean girls in high school.  Promises of sexual encounters and then your out *#$%@& some 24 year old dude named Tito because he has a cool car.  Bastard

Posted by AxeMaster9 on 04/12/09 at 12:02 PM ET

Holland, one of the brightest GMs in the league, didn’t employ the tactic of running contracts out 10+ years and frontloading the money with Datsyuk just two years ago.  Why not?

He had the cap space to sign a “traditional” deal. Which I think everyone, including Kenny himself, would agree is the preferred route—but in this system, when you’ve got great players that want to play for you, you don’t turn them away—you find a way to get it done.

And steroids, again? I mentioned the differences in Chen’s post. Steroids are widely illegal. Players making money, and teams paying it to them, is not. Steroids are detrimental to the player’s physical well being as they age. A long-term contract, if anything, is beneficial to the player, because they have security in finances and can set up a nice home for their family. Steroids set a poor example for youth athletes. Long-term contracts, on the other hand, do nothing more than set the example that loyalty and hard work will be rewarded from the other side with more loyalty and class. Oh, and that it’s okay to earn cash. Which is a fine lesson, as far as I’m concerned.

A bit of tunnel vision here.

Still not clear who is taking advantage?

The team?
or
The player?

I am with you. Contracts are signed when it works for both parties. Franzen and Z signed because they wanted to. Because the long-term security and front-loaded cash was a great deal for them. It allows them to be financially secure for life, earn star-player-type money in their primes, and settle down with job security so they can start families and get comfortable.

So if someone is of the opinion that these types of contracts are “unfair”, then let’s hear you lay into Franzen and Zetterberg, not just Holland and Ilitch, because they’re getting just as much, if not MORE, out of this deal than the Wings are.

spreading salaries over many years to bring the cap hit down - was definitely foreseeable.

I agree, that’s not rocket science. I don’t think it was overlooked. I think it was the one carrot that Little Gary and Jeremy “I’m a Douche Hole” Jacobs gave Detroit, Montreal, Toronto, NYR, Philly, etc., in exchange for how well those ownerships cooperated with the lunacy of the lockout.

Posted by Nathan from Jonny Ericsson's ice cream truck on 04/12/09 at 12:06 PM ET

I agree, that’s not rocket science. I don’t think it was overlooked. I think it was the one carrot that Little Gary and Jeremy “I’m a Douche Hole” Jacobs gave Detroit, Montreal, Toronto, NYR, Philly, etc., in exchange for how well those ownerships cooperated with the lunacy of the lockout.

And after dangling the carrot they decided to douche canoe them in every other aspect of the game.  Well put though.

Posted by AxeMaster9 on 04/12/09 at 12:10 PM ET

Regarding steroids -

Current (testing) years:  The player is a cheater because it is against the rules.  He’s also stupid because there are ways to easily detect steroids, and there are options that do not violate the rules that might also enable him to improve his game without risking suspension.

Pre-testing years:  It wasn’t cheating if there were no rules against it and no testing to enforce the rules.  Was it unethical?  Perhaps, but is having lasik surgery to improve your eyesight to better than you were genetically blessed with also unethical?  Is having tendon surgery to make an elbow stronger than it was originally unethical?  What if someone has asthma and normally would not be able to play a sport at all, but medication enables him to do so.  Does that mean that he shouldn’t be able to play, because his genes and unaided physical ability wouldn’t allow it without modern medical science?

There is an argument that women who have had cosmetic surgery shouldn’t be allowed to win beuty pageants, even if they are the best looking.  Others say that it doesn’t matter what work she has had done, becaus the judging is purely on the end results of whatever she has done to get to that point, exercise, diet, genetics, or surgery - means are irrelevant.  There are also arguments about athletes with prosthetic limbs counting as disabled or not, if by technological means they are every bit as fit as someone who hadn’t lost a limb.  Chemical or surgical enhancement are two sides of the same coin, and yet they are looked at very differently.

I’m deliberately tossing out different scenarios because it isn’t a black-and-white issue, especially not with what has been discovered lately about genetics.  It would be possible in the near future (is right now with lab animals) to insert genes into muscle tissue to generate more protein that would hold oxygen and improve ability in endurance sports.  The only way this would be detected is by taking a muscle tissue biopsy.  However, some athletes are just more talented at endurance sports because they were born with the genes that provide them more of the protein.  So which is the “level playing field” that cheating is meant to circumvent?  Is it level if you permit some athletes with the drive to improve to use means that will compensate for not being blessed from birth with as much ability as others, or is it level if you tell them that they lost the genetic lottery, so tough luck?

A lab actually offers genetic testing to parents for a gene that they claim can help determine if their child is more likely to succeed in endurance sports or more speed-based and power-based sports.  Parents love the idea of eliminating the frustration of “try things that appeal to you and see what you like.” How many athletes would have been lost if they were told as kids not to even bother trying something that their genes didn’t support? 

There is an awful lot of gray in the issue, and more and more gray as medical technology advances.

Personally, I think that anyone who used steroids wasn’t very smart because there is no telling what the long-term negative effects will be, although there are indications that there could be some very bad ones, depending on how long they were used and in what dosages.  However, my job has never relied on whether or not I could come back from surgery quickly enough to demonstrate that I was worth a contract for the next year, so I can understand why an athlete would use any means he could to try to extend his career.

So, to extend it to contract negotiations - the means are provided for any team to do what Holland has been doing, as Philly did with several of their contracts, just as the means were provided for Edmonton to extend an offer sheet to Dustin Penner.  If the options weren’t to be used, then they shouldn’t have been written down.

(And I didn’t hate Barry Bonds for using steroids - I hated him for using his family as props in photo ops and for being an all-around prick.  He didn’t have to be happy all the time, but it wouldn’t have killed him to be civil to others.)

Posted by Baroque from Michigan on 04/12/09 at 12:12 PM ET

Yeah, I mean, as retarded as Gary is when it comes to actual hockey, the dude is a lawyer. I’m sure that wasn’t overlooked. And if it was, Jacobs and his pathetic entourage of bad investors should fire Gary.

Posted by Nathan from Jonny Ericsson's ice cream truck on 04/12/09 at 12:12 PM ET

And to everyone who managed to read through the above essay without their eyes glazing over - I salute you! 

(And that is actually a much-abridged version of what I could say.  There are so many interesting issues about the intersections regarding genetics, bioethics, and athletics that it’s very difficult to keep such a discussion from wandering too far afield.)

Posted by Baroque from Michigan on 04/12/09 at 12:18 PM ET

Baroque you are eloquent, well spoken, intelligent and funny.  What the *#$%@& are you doing here with us?

Posted by AxeMaster9 on 04/12/09 at 12:26 PM ET

I am with you. Contracts are signed when it works for both parties. Franzen and Z signed because they wanted to. Because the long-term security and front-loaded cash was a great deal for them. It allows them to be financially secure for life, earn star-player-type money in their primes, and settle down with job security so they can start families and get comfortable.

So if someone is of the opinion that these types of contracts are “unfair”, then let’s hear you lay into Franzen and Zetterberg, not just Holland and Ilitch, because they’re getting just as much, if not MORE, out of this deal than the Wings are.

Regarding Nathan’s comments - The team is taking less of a risk than it would appear at first, judging by how quickly many fans looked at the contract and their first thought was “so, it will cost the team peanuts to either buy the player out or bury him in the minors if he becomes ineffective at 37 and refuse to gracefully retire.” Also, I have to believe that Zetterberg isn’t the only player who suffers under the uncertainty of ongoing contract negotiations.  Forcing all contracts to be shorter is just going to hurt those who really, really don’t want to deal with the new contract stuff and just know where they are going to play and live for more than the next couple years.  Not true of all players, certainly - but it’s a good thing to leave the option open for those who do want it.

Posted by Baroque from Michigan on 04/12/09 at 12:27 PM ET

Who was it last night that said Hossa may want out of Detroit if they bow out early in this year’s post season? I think it may have been that ever-slappable Al Strachan on The Hotstove on HNIC.

Give me a break.

When you here Wings players talk about why they like it there, it’s not because it’s a place that offers them the possibility at some short-term glory, and then they can pack their bags and hit the road for a better destination. The players speak of an organizational depth that in essence talks about a place, a team, that has enough going for it that players want to stay long-term.

Did Hossa say he went to Detroit because it offered him the best chance to win now? Yes, he did. But what was he going to say at that time? He didn’t know if he’d like the organization to the level he has. That takes time to figure out. He has figured it out.

Mike Illitch is the best owner in sports. Marion Hossa knows that. He has created an organization that is the envy of the other twenty-nine franchises in the N.H.L. Hossa figured that out, too.

He wants to stay. Long-term.

Posted by Red Winger from Sault Ste. Marie on 04/12/09 at 12:29 PM ET

I read it all, Baroque, as I did the previous comment from you; both brilliant and eloquent as always.

The long and the short is that there is no ‘Spirit of The Cap.’ The Cap has no spirit, it is a set of rules and regulations.  There was no gentlemans’ agreement surrounding it, just hard and fast rules that not everybody wanted.  Those who didn’t want it and have now found loopholes in it to use to their advantage are being vilified for following the rules to the letter.  HockeyinHD, where were you last year when Niedermayer, Selanne, and the Ducks violated the ‘Spirit of The Cap?’ Where were you when the Preds, needing to dump salary (despite being far below the cap) traded the rights to negotiate with Kimmo Timonen and Grover Hartnell to the Flyers to get their first-round pick back?  What about those violations of the ‘spirit’ of the rules?

This is adaptation, pure and simple.  We drafted in Europe when no other teams were doing it because we held onto those rights indefinitely and so could follow our plan of giving prospects plenty of time to ‘over-ripen’ before they cracked the roster.  Now that that rights issue has been closed off, surely I’m not the only person who’s noticed how many college-bound players (four years’ rights rather than two) we’re drafting?

Adaptation using ingenuity to maintain an advantage over your competitors.  Survival of the fittest as applied to the NHL.  Got a problem with that?  Go cry about how the world ain’t fair, emo kid.

Posted by AndrewFromAnnArbor from the in-laws' on 04/12/09 at 12:29 PM ET

Slumming? 

I like being around people who are clever, amusing, and not uppity and stuffy.  Believe it or not, you guys fit the bill pretty well. 

Maybe despite your best efforts sometimes, but whatever.

Posted by Baroque from Michigan on 04/12/09 at 12:32 PM ET

Have fun during the liveblog, peoples - off to have dinner with the family (and do my taxes).  Yay, chocolate bunnies - boo, paperwork!

Posted by Baroque from Michigan on 04/12/09 at 12:35 PM ET

Yup, me too-- off to have a fancy dinner and loads of wine and music in a Goidelic language I don’t understand with the in-laws’ neighbors/friends and their idiosyncratic border collie.

Here’s to a ‘statement’ final game of the regular season!

Posted by AndrewFromAnnArbor from the in-laws' on 04/12/09 at 12:52 PM ET

I think there is an aspect we aren’t talking about either here with Hossa and Z and Mule.  Hossa chose to come here.  He wasn’t traded or drafted.  He had the option.  Z, Mule, Yzerman, Lidstrom (and Lindstrom too), Datsyuk, Draper, Maltby etc. These are guys that had no choice to come here in the first place.  They were drafted or traded for.  Yet they all signed here for the duration.  I think that’s important.  We talk a lot about how people stay here because they know how well they are treated and they have a chance to win.  What I think is overlooked is that a professional athlete (even hockey players) want the freedom to choose. The option that their future is their choice.  And who among us doesn’t want that same freedom too.  I think it says a lot more then we realize about the character of this franchise.  Sure winning is great.  Sure being treated well is great.  To sacrifice millions and the option to change things for many years to come says something even greater about the Red Wings.

Hossa will stay if that’s what he wants.  And if he doesn’t want to then I am ok with that.  Sure I will bitch and moan and whine here with my fellow 19 and the Chief if he leaves, but in the end I would rather have a player who makes the decision to stay here because it’s the right place for him, then a player who just wants the quick fix and then hit it the millions.  I don’t know Marian Hossa.  I don’t know the kind of person he is, but I think he showed us a lot by signing here this year.  And I think he will take less money to stay here.  Not because it’s a difference of a million or two, but because it’s the difference of being happy.  Of being happy and content.  The rest, winning and atmosphere and being treated well is all just a bonus.  Look how many players just go for the money.  They are willing to accept being on a losing team.  I don’t want a player like that with us. 

I live and die by The Red Wings.  I will go into a serious depression if we don’t win it all this year.  Not because we should win (which we should) or because we are talented enough and just didn’t get it done (which is possible).  I would be depressed because I love this team.  Win or lose I will stand beside them.  And that is the type of guys they have in their dressing room.  Remember Ozzie crying after 94.  Remember Shanny crying after the punch in the face.  These are the things I remember.  I also get chills watching Mac’s breakaway in 97.  Vlad with the cup in 98.  Yzerman and his daughter in 02.  Z’s face in 08. I don’t care about contracts.  I don’t care about Don Cranberry or Millbury or HNIC.  I don’t care about anything except that moment the game comes on.  I still get the same chills when Pav makes someone look silly.  When Z smiles after a goal.  Cheli looking like he will kill someone every time he steps on the ice.  That’s what matters to me. 

Steroids in baseball has ruined the game for me.  I don’t care about the moral or physical dangers. I care because when I was a kid I would get those same chills when Lou Whitaker would come to bat, or Allen Trammel would make an amazing throw.  Now all I see are needle marks and fakeness.  A-Rod makes me sick.  Bonds. Gross.  It’s the lying that did it for me. The hypocrisy.  Hockey is still pure.  For all the *#$%@& up shit Gary. Ass. has done, Pav’s wink is still pure. 

Sorry I am not as eloquent as Baroque.

Posted by AxeMaster9 on 04/12/09 at 12:56 PM ET

Axe, you are the frigging man.

I *#$%@& love this line:

I don’t care about anything except that moment the game comes on.

And the rest of that post is solid country gold as David Alan Coe would say.  Outstanding work Axe.

Posted by IwoCPO from Sunny San Diego, bitches on 04/12/09 at 01:03 PM ET

Sorry I am not as eloquent as Baroque.

Eloquentness(?) takes on many forms my friend.  Well said.

Posted by calquake on 04/12/09 at 01:09 PM ET

I blacked out, what just happened.  Thanks guys.

Posted by AxeMaster9 on 04/12/09 at 01:27 PM ET

And I think he will take less money to stay here.  Not because it’s a difference of a million or two, but because it’s the difference of being happy

Right on AXE....
I also have never met Hoss, but one thing to remember…
His entire career was directed by contracts and rules from day 1.

Last summer was the first time he was in control of his own career....
And
He called the Wings.

Posted by HockeyTownTodd from A. K. A. NostraGrampus on 04/12/09 at 01:42 PM ET

The most disgusting thing about this debate is that it puts me in the position of siding with Mike Milbury and Gary Bettman… and that sucks.

HA HA, suckaaaa!!!!

Posted by Garth on 04/12/09 at 01:54 PM ET

Look how many players just go for the money.  They are willing to accept being on a losing team.  I don’t want a player like that with us.

Martin Lapointe comes to mind. Look where he is now. A decision I’m sure he now regrets.

Lets Go Red Wings!!!!!

Posted by Kate from Pa. on 04/12/09 at 01:57 PM ET

It implies that Bettman and the NHL are precipient enough to be able to forecast out five or more years

I don’t know what precipient means, but to pretend that this is a long term thing the league couldn’t see is ridiculous.

Daniel Briere.  Scott Gomez.  These two signed front-loaded contracts in 07.  They both made $10M their first year with cap hits of $6.5 and $7.3 respectively.  Whose fault is it that Ken Holland is smart enough to sign players and pay them their worth while having a cap hit below their worth, rather than a cap hit of what was considered their word while actually PAYING them 30-50% more than their worth?

To pretend this was an unforseeable circumvention is absolute rubbish, as has already been pointed out.  It is specifically worded that the AVERAGE salary is the cap hit.  That can NOT be a mistake.  Instead of just saying that “annual salary = cap hit”, which would the the logical default, they -and by “they” I mean “a bunch of lawyers”, as has also been mentioned before- made the conscious decision to word it that way.  This was not a mistake, it was not an oversight.  This was the result of a season-long work stoppage, and for anyone to pretend it was just some slapped together document is ridiculous and moronic.

Posted by Garth on 04/12/09 at 02:20 PM ET

Spirit of the cap, my ass.

Let’s get one thing clear...the spirit of the cap is entirely about destroying teams that perform well over a long period of time, like the Red Wings.  So those who say it is not in the spirit of the cap make an excellent point, because its not.  This signing and a possible Hossa deal make it clear that the Wings are going to be a powerhouse for years to come, and that violates the spirit of the cap.  It says unconditionally that we will not let Gary.Ass ruin our hockey club, and that violates the spirit of the cap. 

What this signing says is that Gary.Ass and his cap can go %#?! themselves.  It doesn’t matter what kind of a “parity system” Gary.Ass puts in place, the Wings are here to win and they will continue to do so under any circumstances.  That’s why these critics are so pissed...this puts a little more distance between their teams and the Wings.

And you know what?  I don’t care.  I have said this before, and many of the 19 have as well...I am not an NHL fan, I am not a hockey fan.  I am a Wings fan, and Tick Tock is doing right by me.

Posted by John from Pittsburgh, PA (Wings fan for life!) on 04/12/09 at 02:41 PM ET

Obama + Presidency = Socalism

Bettman + NHL Comissioner = President Obama

Just a little more math for you all since it has been such a hot topic as of late.

Piss off Gary.

Posted by Surfer Ken from San Clemente on 04/12/09 at 02:43 PM ET

.the spirit of the cap is entirely about destroying teams that perform well over a long period of time, like the Red Wings.

Totally wrong.

The Salary cap is so that the Franchises have the opportunity to nail down fixed overhead costs.  The aim of all public and private businesses based in a democratic society.

Just business, my friend.

Posted by HockeyTownTodd from A. K. A. NostraGrampus on 04/12/09 at 02:57 PM ET

Scott Morrison talks about the fact that Tick Tock and the Hossa camp were in deep discussions yesterday afternoon, and that it’s looking like he’s staying in Detroit, and that the Cap is not an issue.  I take that to mean that if he does sign, it will be at a number friendly to the Wings and maybe even one that allows Holland to hold on to at least one of these three: Hudler, Conklin, Samuelsson.

If they can sign Hossa AND Happy? WOW. My dream come true.

Posted by detroitdan1982 from St. John's, NL on 04/12/09 at 03:09 PM ET