Chief, you’re up.  I’m about to hit the hay.  And I agree…nobody who wears the Winged Wheel ever lays down for anyone.  Go Wings.

Posted by cephalopod from Chicago...nope, still not over it. on 05/30/09 at 04:58 AM ET

I truly hope no one is insinuating that he’s a malingerer.  Didn’t some people have a similar discussion a few weeks back about Rafalski, and if he was waiting “too long” to come back because he wasn’t tough enough to deal with the pain or take a shot to handle it?  I remember comments about how he should be traded if he was taking “too much time off” - despite the fact that no one outside of the team knows how severe the injuries are and some fans are quick to assume that the solution to everything is to rub dirt on it and get back out there.

The constant nagging doubting of their dedication bothers me.  These aren’t soft players.

If Datsyuk can, by any means, perform well enough to help the team he will be on the ice - if he isn’t, it won’t be because it hurts too much.  It will be because he can’t be useful enough yet to not be a liability.  Not because he’s too chicken to tough it out.  That’s why I think it’s a lot more than just pain management.  His mobility is very important - if he can’t slither away from checks, Pittsburgh will pick up on that and will exploit that weakness.  A little lost speed, he can deal with - reduced maneuverability will be hazardous.

(And I understand it’s just the musings of the playoff stress talking, too.)

And if the option is play in game one and possibly miss the rest of the series, or give it one more day and that should be enough to get fully recovered (as the playoffs do start with three games in four nights), I know that I want him on the ice for the most games possible.

Posted by Baroque from Michigan on 05/30/09 at 05:24 AM ET

If Datsyuk can, by any means, perform well enough to help the team he will be on the ice - if he isn’t, it won’t be because it hurts too much.  It will be because he can’t be useful enough yet to not be a liability.

That’s all I’m saying Baroque.  I’ve never insinuated he, or any other Wing, are malingering. 

If it’s a pain thing, I hope he can play through it.  If he can play and not injure it any further and play well? Then I hope he does.

Posted by IwoCPO from Sunny San Diego, bitches on 05/30/09 at 05:28 AM ET

Good morning, Chief, 19…

Numbed that bitch with Busch

Busch?  FTS.  Pabst Blue Ribbon!

These aren’t soft players.

Right on Baroque.  They’re not.  Which means this hesitation implies they’re really hurt.  Ericksson should not skate this weekend.  Neither should pavs.  Nik; absolutely.  He’s the captain, even if he’s bleeding from one eye and is missing a toe, he’s skating.  Rest the other guys for game 3.  We’ll need them.

Posted by Hippy Dave from Portland by way of Detroit on 05/30/09 at 05:31 AM ET

I’ve never insinuated he, or any other Wing, are malingering. 

I know you’re not - it’s the easy thing for some others to do, though.  And I know everyone who comments here knows a friend, coworker, family member, or someone else who does just that - insinuate that because someone isn’t playing, they “lack desire” or aren’t willing to “tough it out.”  And these are almost inevitably the same people who need to call in to work because they are out injured for three days because they stapled a couple fingers together and the pain is too much to bear until they get a prescription.

It makes me want to kick them between the legs so hard their voice rises in pitch so it is only audible to nearby dogs.

Posted by Baroque from Michigan on 05/30/09 at 05:38 AM ET

From the mothership:

Drapes sounds hopeful, might be Babs making him hungry…
http://www.nhl.tv/team/console.jsp?id=42805

Reporter: “Will you need to freeze the foot to play?”
Pavel: “It doesn’t matter what I need, I need (it?) to play, this is for sure.”
http://www.nhl.tv/team/console.jsp?id=42796

Maxime Talbot with some good finer points, saying essentially that perhaps without losing Hossa they wouldn’t have become the team they are today:
http://www.nhl.tv/team/console.jsp?id=42796

Posted by Hippy Dave from Portland by way of Detroit on 05/30/09 at 05:53 AM ET

HAH!  Chief!  I finally read the “How Others View The A2Y 19” righthand sidebar to this column.

Hiiii-larious.

Praise for Ceasar.

Posted by Hippy Dave from Portland by way of Detroit on 05/30/09 at 06:16 AM ET

do the wings really need datsyuk?  i mean they just won the conference championship without him and lidstrom.  if its taking this much time to “test it out”, just screw it.  its probably as bad as it seems if not worse.  the wings dont need datsyuk to win.  they’ve proven that.  hes been kinda lame this post season and hasnt been much of a factor anyway.  they won the last round basically without him, so the best that can happen is he comes back and turns his game around and instead of winning games 3-2 or 4-2 they win 6 or 7-2.  big whoop.

Posted by ya i know from so what on 05/30/09 at 06:25 AM ET

Posted by ya i know from so what on 05/30/09 at 07:25 AM ET

Pittsburgh Penguins not = Chicago Blackhawks.

Crosby, Malkin > Kane, Toews (at least this year, anyway)

Posted by Baroque from Michigan on 05/30/09 at 06:31 AM ET

HAH!  Chief!  I finally read the “How Others View The A2Y 19” righthand sidebar to this column.

Thanks Dave.  It’s due for an upgrade. Just as HTT.  Hopefully this summer.

Posted by IwoCPO from Sunny San Diego, bitches on 05/30/09 at 06:32 AM ET

What do they put in the water in Michigan anyway?

Beer.

Posted by Hippy Dave from Portland by way of Detroit on 05/30/09 at 06:49 AM ET

do the wings really need datsyuk?

Baroque answered this one quite succinctly earlier, but I want to reiterate YES, the Wings really need YES Datsyuk to YES skate in this series.  The Blackhawks may look like a younger Pittsburgh team (who, last season, looked like a younger Red Wings team), but they’re not close to equals.

Posted by J.J. from Kansas on 05/30/09 at 07:23 AM ET

Do you guys really think Gary Bettman is smart enough to engineer a league-wide conspiracy for or against anything, let alone more than one thing?  What do they put in the water in Michigan anyway? 

Have you actually read any of the recent posts?

This, from here:

It doesn’t have to be a sinister thing.  There is no Deep Throat, no Jeff Gillooly, no Shoeless Joe giving in to a little fiscal temptation.

It just boils down to this and it’s real simple:  Gary Bettman does not like the Detroit Red Wing organ-I-zation and he would like Sidney Crosby to hoist the Cup. 

It’s not a conspiracy, it’s just a deep burning hatred that Bettman feels for Mike Ilitch, Jimmy Devellano and Ken Holland.

and this:

It’s not a conspiracy.  It’s just a little man who’s held an important job for too long.

and this:

And I just don’t understand why the Commisioner of the sport with said successful franchise continues to try and derail them.

I mean, I know why he is doing it… he’s made Crosby in specific and the Penguins in general the NHL’s posterboard franchise, so if they keep getting thumped by someone else… that doesn’t look good.  I just don’t undertstand why he tried to create a marketing phenomenon trhough force and repetition rather than simply marketing the NHL as it is.

But there’s quite a few things about Bettman’s strategy with regards to the NHL that I don’t grasp.

Posted by HockeyinHD on 05/28/09 at 08:49 AM ET

and this:

As you say, it’s no conspiracy—Bettman grudgingly knows the Wings are necessary—but those who don’t understand our view need to understand that

it doesn’t mean the NHL Office isn’t praying for a usurper.

Posted by Matt Saler from Grand Rapids, MI on 05/28/09 at 08:55 AM ET

and this:

It’s true — whether it’s a conscious conspiracy or not — that the NHL front-office favors their own agenda, putting league revenue and marketing above the well-being of players and their strongest franchises. As someone pointed out above, the marketing poster-child and franchise are back in the most desirable and profitable situation. They won their series in 4 straight and have had a little bit of rest. Gary’s going to milk that for all it’s worth. If it hurts the banged up Wings, I’m sure he’s not losing any sleep.

Posted by beardChamp on 05/28/09 at 10:21 AM ET

and this:

If, hypothetically, Bettman chose Ovechkin, Dion Phaneuf, or *gasp* Henrik Zetterberg to be THE face of the post-lockout NHL, then he would be pulling for that guy instead.  He didn’t.  Crosby was given center stage before playing a single game.  Even Ovechkin has had to earn a lot of his press.  And I’m not saying that Crosby hasn’t earned a good deal of the publicity he’s received, but that was given to him from day 1.  So Little Gary put all the marketing eggs into one basket, and now he’s got to hope it works.  Seriously, ask yourself if you were Gary Bettman (Ass), who would you prefer to see win this series?  The Detroit Red Wings, whose players are not promoted as individuals by the league to the world and have already won 4 cups in 11 years… or the Pittsburgh Penguins led by your self-chosen Golden Boy, upon whose shoulders you’ve put the fortunes of an entire league?

And even though it may sound like it, I’m not complaining.  At least not about Crosby himself.  I think he’s an elite talent (there’s that word again).  What I have a problem with is the league’s moronic handing of post-lockout publicity, and the hype machine that has been built around one player, no matter who it is or what team he plays for.  If Datsyuk or Zetterberg were the face(s) of the league, I’d be just as annoyed with the morons in the NHL’s PR dept.

But, if you don’t think Bettman would prefer that Crosby and the Pens win the cup this year, you’re effing delusional.

Posted by Incognetis from Exile in Alabama on 05/28/09 at 06:33 PM ET

and this, from here:

Why are we confusing whining with legitimate complaints?  Yes, we Wing fans are upset about the quick turnaround, but Pens fans should be too.  Neutrals should be because neither team will be on their game in game 2 if the first goes deep into OT. Furthermore, it makes the premier league in the sport we all love look like the 2-bit operation into which Little Gary has turned it.  All because NBC can’t disrupt Conan, and they have no respect for the NHL.

This just gives NHL-haters more ammunition.  It’s bad for the players, it’s bad for the neutrals, it’s bad for TV ratings.  Thanks again, Gary.  Ass.

Terrible Ted’s right, like it or not.  I’d like to know how Alice, er, Adam Brady would feel if the Ducks had to deal with this back-to-back business… if they hadn’t driven Getzlaf into the ground already, they certainly would have done so by game 2.

Posted by Incognetis from Exile in Alabama on 05/29/09 at 12:41 AM ET

also this:

You’re missing the point. There’s only a one-day discrepancy in rest for the two teams, so it’s not about rest, necessarily. It’s about the NHL trying to get their game on NBC so hard, that they’re going to sacrifice the quality of it by making one of the two NBC games the second night of a back-to-back. That’s not what you want on a showcase game two, in the finals, on U.S. national broadcast television.

The game won’t win many casual fans over with short shifts, heavier than usual doses of Hal Gill and Brett Lebda, and a lot of junk play in the neutral zone because both teams are on guard about not getting caught tired in the (to that point) biggest game of the year.

If the only issue here is Conan’s debut, the NHL should’ve insisted they take two days between games one and two, and have game two start at 7pm. That would give them over 4 hours of time to finish the game before Conan. If the game did run late, at least it wouldn’t be Conan’s debut night. And in a lot of cases, you might snag an extra viewer or two that tune in around 11pm waiting for the Tonight Show to start.

Two days between games one and two would be crummy, as well, but certainly better. At least it would mean both games on NBC would be with both teams with full tanks of gas, ready to play their absolute best hockey.

Posted by Nathan from Jonny Ericsson’s ice cream truck on 05/29/09 at 09:12 AM ET

Thoughts from a half dozen people - and I could find more, too.

Seriously, are illiterates on the internet now?

What part of “it’s not a conspiracy” don’t you get?  Too many big words with multiple syllables?

FACT:  Crosby was annointed the “face of the NHL” even before he was drafted.

FACT:  Crosby winning a Stanley Cup would be an image that not even the NHL, with the marketing acumen of a flock of retarded gnats, could screw up.

FACT:  The NHL commisioner would love to have such an image as a marketing hook.

This is not in dispute among reasonable people.

Is the league deliberately scripting events to play out as they wish, like the Emperor seeing everything unfolding as he had forseen - right up until Darth Vader threw him into the pit?  NO.  They don’t have the foresight, intelligence, or planning ability to pull that off even if they wanted to.

But it DOESN’T mean they aren’t hoping that the Penguins can pull off the win.  It makes pure business sense, the same way that baseball benefits if the Yankees are doing well, the same way they turned their heads so they wouldn’t see how many players were taking steroids as long as the money flowed in, the same way David Stern once said his ideal NBA finals matchup would be the Lakers vs. the Lakers, the same way MLS hoped that bringing over David Beckham and his cute accent and his celebrity wife would vault soccer into American prominence, the same way that reprehensible Mike Vick is likely going to get a second chance as a quarterback if it looks like he can actually play once his sentence is up and he’s reinstated, the same way the NHLPA guy a few weeks ago said that sweeps in the playoffs were bad for revenues, and he personally preferred longer series just because they brought in more money.

In terms of business, the NHL would prefer Crosby to win a Cup ASAP because it is a good publicity hook for them and a story that even the most incompetent and laziest of incompetent, lazy-ass journalists can burp out using two fingers on their keyboards.

It’s not about a conspiracy, it’s about excessive marketing and jamming the chosen storyline down the throats of the public repeatedly whether they want it or not.

That’s it.

Try reading once in a while.  It might better inform your opinions.

Or shut up.  Whatever works for you.  Jeez.

Posted by Baroque from Michigan on 05/30/09 at 07:35 AM ET

Morning 19. Hey Chief, could you stop needling Pavs? Just messing with you. If there is anything I am sure of, it is the fact that he will take the needle, and he should.

Even at 80% he is one of the best guys to ever play the game. If he is skating, the boot fits. If he is hurting, he will deal with it. I believe it pains a player much more by having to watch.

Even the Perfect Human admitted to being a wreck as he watched game 5.  Bitches.

Lets Go Red Wings!!!!!

Posted by Kate from Pa.-made in Detroit on 05/30/09 at 07:41 AM ET

The wife has me come home early from work yesterday.  I arrive to find the house empty of kids and dogs with suitcases packed.  Saturday is our anniversary.  She says that she booked a weekend at a hotel, alone.  I had planned to go to dinner at a nice restaurant at a time early enough to not miss the game.  So, as diplomatic as I could, I asked about our dinner plans.  She said I should cancel them, she had plans of her own.  Trying not to sound like a whiny three year old wanting to watch Sponge Bob, I asked “what about the Wings game?”  That’s when she dropped the bombshell:  she bought tickets for the game and packed my Datsyuk jersey.  Man, I married well! 

Anyway, Datsyuk will play tonight, wearing my lucky Pavel jersey.  4 to 12!

Posted by Tuba Guy from Royal Oak, MI on 05/30/09 at 07:43 AM ET

And these are almost inevitably the same people who need to call in to work because they are out injured for three days because they stapled a couple fingers together and the pain is too much to bear until they get a prescription.

Sometimes we just mean the pain of going to work, Baroque.  I’ve stapled my fingers together on purpose before, just so I wouldn’t have to go in and deal with those people.

And wait…Baroque’s talking about kicking people?  And she’s posting epic-length comments? And she’s feeding the trolls?

Awesome! The finals must start today.   (Great post above by the way.)

Posted by Gabriel from San Diego, CA on 05/30/09 at 07:45 AM ET

Good luck.  The Wings used to be my second-favorite team as a kid.  They remained so until last year when I learned what schmucks their fans are (or at least you guys are).  Stevie Y was my favorite non-Penguin.  I had Lidstrom’s and Fedorov’s rookie cards.

Bandwagon.

Posted by monkey from here to Timbuktu on 05/30/09 at 07:48 AM ET

The wife has me come home early from work yesterday.  I arrive to find the house empty of kids and dogs with suitcases packed.  Saturday is our anniversary.  She says that she booked a weekend at a hotel, alone.  I had planned to go to dinner at a nice restaurant at a time early enough to not miss the game.  So, as diplomatic as I could, I asked about our dinner plans.  She said I should cancel them, she had plans of her own.  Trying not to sound like a whiny three year old wanting to watch Sponge Bob, I asked “what about the Wings game?” That’s when she dropped the bombshell:  she bought tickets for the game and packed my Datsyuk jersey.  Man, I married well! 

Anyway, Datsyuk will play tonight, wearing my lucky Pavel jersey.  4 to 12!

Posted by Tuba Guy from Royal Oak, MI on 05/30/09 at 08:43 AM ET

Great relationship that you clearly understand each other so well.  You are very, very lucky - and don’t ever forget that. 

And wait…Baroque’s talking about kicking people?  And she’s posting epic-length comments? And she’s feeding the trolls?

Awesome! The finals must start today. 

What can I say - I woke up fidgety, cranky, jittery, irritable, and snappish - and that isn’t normally like me.

(Great post above by the way.)
Posted by Gabriel from San Diego, CA on 05/30/09 at 08:45 AM ET

Thanks.  I just find it irritating when people say the same things over and over and over and over and over and over - despite the fact that they people they are claiming believe one thing have said repeatedly that they don’t believe that thing that they are being accused of believing in.  (Must be why I hate all politicians - the incessant blah, blah, blah, blah.)

Posted by Baroque from Michigan on 05/30/09 at 07:53 AM ET

That’s when she dropped the bombshell:  she bought tickets for the game and packed my Datsyuk jersey.

TubaGuy, congrats man. Your wife needs to put on seminars for other wives.

Posted by Gabriel from San Diego, CA on 05/30/09 at 07:57 AM ET

I cracked a rib a few years ago playing softball.

May I quote LT Dan Caffee, “Big game against Bethesda Medical”, Chief ??

BTW, for whatever the hell it’s worth, I’d be absolutely shocked if Datsyuk ISN’T in there tonight.

Good luck boys…. Well, not really, you know what I mean…. :D

Posted by Tony F from Virginia Beach, VA on 05/30/09 at 08:00 AM ET

Shit, he was a LTJG, my khaki’s aren’t that old, I knew that….

Posted by Tony F from Virginia Beach, VA on 05/30/09 at 08:01 AM ET

Crosby winning a Stanley Cup would be an image that not even the NHL, with the marketing acumen of a flock of retarded gnats, could screw up.

Baroque, I think I love you.

Posted by Hippy Dave from Portland by way of Detroit on 05/30/09 at 08:03 AM ET

Tuba Guy:

That’s when she dropped the bombshell:  she bought tickets for the game and packed my Datsyuk jersey.

Hockey wives rule.

Yours is officially cooler than mine.

Don’t tell anyone, especially her.

Posted by Hippy Dave from Portland by way of Detroit on 05/30/09 at 08:05 AM ET

“what about the Wings game?” That’s when she dropped the bombshell:  she bought tickets for the game and packed my Datsyuk jersey.  Man, I married well!

Posted by Tuba Guy from Royal Oak, MI on 05/30/09 at 08:43 AM ET

And I think my husband is the luckiest guy in the world. At least that is what he tells me. Happy Anniversary.

Lets Go Red Wings!!!!!

Posted by Kate from Pa.-made in Detroit on 05/30/09 at 08:06 AM ET

same way David Stern once said his ideal NBA finals matchup would be the Lakers vs. the Lakers,

Nice work Baroque. I am surprised that NHL.com doesn’t have two Crosbys facing off against each other.

Lets Go Red Wings!!!!!

Posted by Kate from Pa.-made in Detroit on 05/30/09 at 08:11 AM ET

Ooo!  Paul posted my Members Blog post just now.  I’m most interested in all of your stories, people.

http://www.kuklaskorner.com/index.php/kmb/

Posted by Hippy Dave from Portland by way of Detroit on 05/30/09 at 08:11 AM ET

Personally, I’ll be glad when this series is over,  just so all the strangers who are sitting in our living room will finally just go the eff away.

I don’t give two shakes of a dead rats ass about what ANY Penguins fan thinks about this blog, it’s participants, or our opinions.

It’s just plain rude to crash a party, then start complaining about the music.

Stay out of my beer fridge, and get off my mother-effing lawn.

OZ-ZIE!
OZ-ZIE!
OZ-ZIE!

Posted by dougie on 05/30/09 at 08:11 AM ET

Hmm. My take on the Rafalski situation is that the Wings brass told him to get back to 100%, because they felt they had a team that could win that series, even with Rafalski on the sidelines.

As for the Dangle situation… it is the SCF, so what read can we got on it? You don’t hold a guy out even a game as a precaution, at this point. It’s time to roll ‘em all out there and give it everything you’ve got.

Posted by Nathan from the scoresheet! on 05/30/09 at 08:14 AM ET

Ooo!  Paul posted my Members Blog post just now.  I’m most interested in all of your stories, people.

http://www.kuklaskorner.com/index.php/kmb/

Posted by Hippy Dave from San Francisco by way of Detroit on 05/30/09 at 09:11 AM ET

Wow.  I don’t even remember my first post, it was so long ago.  It’s amazing to think how long I’ve been online and a part of this community - and I totally suck at keeping track of people in real life.

Posted by Baroque from Michigan on 05/30/09 at 08:15 AM ET

Is it 10:00 yet?

Lets Go Red Wings!!!!!

Posted by Kate from Pa.-made in Detroit on 05/30/09 at 08:20 AM ET

my khaki’s aren’t that old

Concur, but you’re missing out on the NWUs. 

Good luck tonite.  I’ll be in Norfolk some time this summer.  Beers to the winner?

Posted by IwoCPO from Sunny San Diego, bitches on 05/30/09 at 08:39 AM ET

Baroque, that was awesome.

Posted by Rumbear from Top O da Hasek, sippin rum & catchin some rays on 05/30/09 at 09:46 AM ET

Concur, but you’re missing out on the NWUs. 

Good luck tonite.  I’ll be in Norfolk some time this summer.  Beers to the winner?

Absolutely….

IRT the NWU’s, I’ve seen them on base.  Takes some getting used to….

Posted by Tony F from Virginia Beach, VA on 05/30/09 at 09:56 AM ET

This conspiracy talk is getting old.

Does someone have a timeline indicating when the back-to-back schedule was first announced by the NHL, in comparison to when Pavel and Nick got injured?

Posted by alexcutter on 05/30/09 at 10:09 AM ET

It’s not about a conspiracy, it’s about excessive marketing and jamming the chosen storyline down the throats of the public repeatedly whether they want it or not.
That’s it.
Try reading once in a while.  It might better inform your opinions.
Or shut up.  Whatever works for you.  Jeez.

Posted by Baroque from Michigan on 05/30/09 at 08:35 AM ET

And this:

What can I say - I woke up fidgety, cranky, jittery, irritable, and snappish - and that isn’t normally like me.

and with this,

I just find it irritating when people say the same things over and over and over and over and over and over - despite the fact that they people they are claiming believe one thing have said repeatedly that they don’t believe that thing that they are being accused of believing in.  (Must be why I hate all politicians - the incessant blah, blah, blah, blah.)

Posted by Baroque from Michigan on 05/30/09 at 08:53 AM ET

Baroque - What can I say? The time & effort you put in to research & post your ‘We know it ain’t a “conspiracy”! It’s ‘lil gary being an ass! Which is BAD for all true hockey fans and the integrity of the great game of hockey.’’ is FANTASTIC!!! (I’m jealous. It makes me wish I were a english major or journalist instead of an engineer.) GOOD WORK! even with the SCF jitters. I’m there with you. If it brings good mojo, stay “irritable”.

4 to 12, boys
4 to 12

Posted by stonehands-78 from the beginning ... a WingsFan, on 05/30/09 at 10:26 AM ET

Ooo!  Paul posted my Members Blog post just now.  I’m most interested in all of your stories, people.

http://www.kuklaskorner.com/index.php/kmb/

Posted by Hippy Dave from San Francisco by way of Detroit on 05/30/09 at 09:11 AM ET

HD - Good idea. I’ll try to put something together a little longer maybe, but in a nut shell, my joining became good therapy after I lost my eldest son, Josh, my best friend, my Red Wings buddy. We were dedicated Red Wing fanatics together. He went to be with the Lord on 05/05/07 when the Wings were making their run that spring. I was a sideliner at that time here but I sorta lost track of things after 05/05 for some time. Tough deal on me. Real tough. (He was 19 at the time.)

The following spring, the Wings were again making their run but I didn’t have JNH to share the excitement with me in person. A2Y helped me coup and I became an official member on 04/04/08. As history now records, the Wings ‘won one for Josh’ and the 19 last year. I’ve been hooked ever since! The bond shared here, connected by the same passion for hockey in general and the Wings specifically, is really a joy! I’m sure Josh would be sharing in the fun!

For JNH and the 19, do it again, boys!

4 to 12

Posted by stonehands-78 from the beginning ... a WingsFan, on 05/30/09 at 10:52 AM ET

Someone here may have mentioned something about knees and faces, but what I’d like to see is Datsyuk being Datsyuk.

What I’d really love to see is a 34.7 kick to the groin, rip the beating heart out and eat it while it’s still pumping blood where Datsyuk knocks some fool defenseman into next week, undresses the goalie, breaks his goal-less steak and wins the Cup all in one fell Datsyukian sweep. 

That’s why I like Datsyuk - he’s the crazed monstrosity who could actually pull that off.

The post game interview would just be icing on the cake.

Posted by jrl123 on 05/30/09 at 02:07 PM ET