The Confluence
Next entry: Crosby goes Yard at PNC Park
Previous entry: The Confluence Facebook Page Now Up and Running
Penguins Roundtable Part III: The Goalie
by Tony on 09/08/10 at 09:21 AM ET
Comments (2)
Now that we’ve looked at the defense and the forwards, Part III of our Penguins Roundtable will discuss the guy between the pipes, Marc-Andre Fleury.
Once again, the participants:
Rick Moldovanyi (RM) - The Pensblog
Jesse Marshall (JM) - Faceoff Factor
Brian Metzer (BM) - From The Point
Mike Colligan (MC) - The Hockey Writers
Sean Leahy (SL) - Yahoo! Puck Daddy
Jimmy Rixner (JR) - SB Nation Pittsburgh
Tony Ferrante (TF) - The Confluence at Kukla’s Korner
Q: If there’s been any one player on the Penguins’ roster that’s generated the most controversy, there’s no doubt that’s been Marc-Andre Fleury. While it was largely Fleury’s stellar play in Games 6 and 7 of the ‘09 Stanley Cup Finals to capture the Cup for the Penguins, his GAA and Save Pct. are regularly among the worst of starting NHL goaltenders. What’s your overall opinion of Fleury’s performance over the years? Is there anything you attribute for his poor statistics? How do you believe he will fare in the coming years?
(RM) - Marc-Andre Fleury is an excellent goaltender, regardless of what anyone else says. His major problem seems to be emotional, not athletic. Fleury is quite the emotional player and he sometimes falls apart after letting in a bad goal or when he’s faced with too much pressure. Of course, this is a bad problem for a goalie to have.
Marc-Andre Fleury can definitely play under pressure. We saw that in the 2009 playoffs. I put less stock in GAA and Save %, especially last year, because of how “soff” the Pens defense was. Any goaltender hung out to dry as often as Fleury was last year will crack.
As for how he will do this year, it depends on the defense and how well the team supports him. Fleury is an excellent goalie and able to make key saves in games (see Ovechkin, Alex in 2009) but he can’t make 20 key saves each game. He needs his team to limit opportunities.
=========================
(JM) - Pittsburgh has a penchant for making the two most popular people in the city the back-up quarterback and the back-up goaltender. That said, last season wasn’t a ringing endorsement for Marc-Andre Fleury. Don’t get me wrong, you might even call me a Fleury apologist, but some of his performances last year were inexcusable, pourous defense or not.
Fleury is getting to that point where goaltenders start to blossom (pun intended), and this year could be considered his most important. There’s never been question about his athletic ability, the Game 7 save against Nick Lidstrom tells you all you need to know, it’s the consistency and the mental aspect that needs more attention. We know he can make the amazing save that brings you out of your seat, but what about the routine save on the high shot from the circle?
Make no bones about it, this year Marc-Andre Fleury will step behind what I believe to be the best defensive corps that he has ever played behind. The additions of Martin and Michalek, along with the continued maturation of Letang and Goligoski, will solidify the Penguins blueline in a way fans in Pittsburgh haven’t seen in quite some time. Marc-Andre Fleury needs to bring his A game. There are no excuses this time.
=========================
(BM) - Marc Andre Fleury is probably the biggest lightning rod for criticism on the Penguins roster. No matter what the kid does on a year to year basis it doesn’t seem to be enough to appease the Penguins faithful. I agree with you that his goals against average and save percentage haven’t necessarily been where you would expect them to be based on his status as a former 1st overall draft pick, but more times than not he seems to make the big save when it is needed. Fleury has won at least 35 games in three of the last four seasons and in the fourth year he notched 19 victories in 35 starts, which is good enough to play on my team any day.
Fleury did take a little of a step backwards last season in the actual stats department, but that can be attributed to the fall off in the defense in front of him. The group didn’t do a good enough job of eliminating second and third chances and they ended up in the net. The Flower should be able to bounce back towards being the goaltender that he was two years ago now that the Penguins defense as a whole looks to be much improved.
MAF wins big games and he plays his best hockey in the playoffs where he has already notched 38 career victories. Yes the kid occasionally bleeds a soft goal, but he has historically been there to secure victory when his team has needed him to be. Look for the Flower to bloom this season and notch upwards of 43 wins. He may never end up being a guy who consistently notches a sub 2.00 goals against average or a .970 save percentage, but he doesn’t have to. When you consider the fire power that skates in front of him on a nightly basis, what he has done and will do is more than enough for this team to be successful.
=========================
(MC) - This is a pivotal year for Fleury. With the additions of Martin and Michalek the Penguins defense is as strong as it’s been in years. If he puts up mediocre numbers then fans will start to accept that he’s just a flashy, big-save goalie that can’t put it together for a full season. But if Fleury takes the step forward that I think he will, the Penguins can feel comfortable with the thought that he’s progressing just as any other young goaltender would.
Many forget that he’s just 25 years old and the average goalie doesn’t peak until he’s close to 30. His performance two seasons ago in the Penguins’ Stanley Cup run was rare for someone his age.
Last season, I think there may have been more at play than just youth and a Championship-hangover. He broke the ring finger on his catching hand in January and came back to play with splint underneath his glove. In an effort to avoid take shots to the finger, he started awkwardly using his body more and changing his angles. Once the finger healed, he never seemed to re-adjust and his glove hand side was abused by Ottawa and Montreal in the playoffs. With a summer to reset and recharged, I think Fleury picks up where he left off two seasons ago.
=========================
(SL) - Fleury has had trouble with consistency over the years and has benefited from the fact that the players in front of him are incredibly talented ... but so is he. He’ll turn just 26 years old later this year and has plenty of developing left to do, but who else would Penguins fans want in their net (that’s acquirable)?
Fleury’s down moments often snowball after he allows one of his patented “soft goals”, but he’s shown over his young career that he has the ability to shed the negative aspects of his game. Remember when his rebound control was horrendous? Remember when his crease positioning was all over the place? With the help of Gilles Meloche, Fleury has worked on those aspects of his game to better himself.
And like with any goaltender, 99% of it is in his head. As long as Fleury’s confidence, he can continue to develop as a top-flight NHL goaltender. We’ve seen glimpses of brilliance during his six-year career and there’s no doubt there’s plenty left to see.
=========================
(JR) - Marc-Andre Fleury won’t ever be a statistical leading goalie in categories like goals against and save percentage. I think a large function of that is how the Penguins play. The Penguins style is to play in the other zone, cycle, work the corners, wear the other team down and take over late. It’s impossible to score when the puck is 160 feet away from your net for most of the game.
So despite being seen as having a poor defense in 2009-10, the Pens only allowed 28.7 shots per game (6th best in the league) . Even in the playoffs, the Pens allowed only 26.6 shots per game (2nd best behind a New Jersey team that got bounced in five games)
The problem was the quality of shots given up; Pittsburgh’s aggressiveness and sometimes questionable defensive left them vulnerable to frequent odd man rushes the other way, something a team with fast forwards good at a transitional game could and did take advantage of in May.
Adding Paul Martin and Zbynek Michalek gives a huge boost to the defensive ability of the team. Stylistically the Pens hope not to be much different, but with more capable defensemen playing more minutes, the severity of defensive lapses figure to go down; which by default should boost the play of the goalie. That all looks really great written on paper before the season begins, doesn’t it?
Focus and consistency has always been an issue with Fleury and it seems when he plays a ton of games in the season, he doesn’t have enough in the tank mentally for a playoff run. Brent Johnson has proven to be a reliable option as a backup (as long as he stays healthy) and the Pens would be wise to try and keep Fleury to about 55 starts so that he can be fresh for the playoffs.
Then again, Fleury usually gives the team the best chance to win on any given night, so it’ll probably be difficult for management to hold him off for 25+ games this season. It’d be for the best to keep him fresh, but the temptation might be too much to make it possible.
=========================
(TF) - If you’re a regular reader of this blog, you no doubt know that I’m not as sympathetic towards Fleury as some of my colleagues, which is fine. Please don’t get me wrong, I firmly believe the Penguins don’t win the ‘09 Cup without Fleury. And yes, there are times when he looks like not only an upper tier NHL goalie, but among the top handful. However, there are also plenty of times when he makes you want to throw your damn remote through the TV.
I’m just not as willing to lay the majority of the blame for Fleury’s struggles on the lack of a stout defense. Is it partly to blame? Yes, absolutely. But there are simply too many situations where Fleury lets a horribly soft goal in, ones that have absolutely nothing to do with the defense. And it’s the higher frequency of those soft goals that I believe his stats are so mediocre.
As Mike pointed out, maybe his hand injury was worse that was let on. The only reason that I’m not confident that was the case, as I stated in my last article discussing Fleury, is that he has ranked no higher than 23rd in the NHL in GAA and 21st in Save Pct., both of those occurring in the Cup winning season of ‘08-‘09. Without trying to be too obvious, the point I’m trying to make with those stats is that he gives up more goals per game and doesn’t save more shots than the majority of goalies in the NHL, and he’s been that way for his career so far.
Maybe this is the year that we’ll start to see Fleury blossom (no pun intended) into that quote/unquote elite goaltender. After all, even though he’s considered a veteran goalie, he’s only going to turn 26 in November. I sure hope so.
Filed in: | The Confluence | Permalink
Tags: NHL-Hockey, Pittsburgh+Penguins,
Comments
I pretty much echo what Brian Metzer and Jimmy Rixner (which is an awesome name) said, and OneSmugPug you have a really good point. Those three together are my thoughts, maybe subtracting one point or two.
Posted by NathanBC on 09/08/10 at 11:07 AM ET
Add a Comment
Please limit embedded image or media size to 575 pixels wide.
Add your own avatar by joining Kukla's Korner, or logging in and uploading one in your member control panel.
Captchas bug you? Join KK or log in and you won't have to bother.
Commenting is not available in this weblog entry.
Most Recent Blog Posts
Turn Out The Lights, The Party’s Over: I’m Stepping Down
Bill Cowher’s Daughter to Marry Kevin Westgarth
Penguins Sign Forward Steve MacIntyre
Penguins Re-Sign Forward Dustin Jeffrey to Two-Year Deal
Crosby Donation Leads To Renovation at Children’s Hospital
About Kukla’s Korner
Kukla’s Korner is updated around the clock with the work of our own talented bloggers, plus links to the best hockey writing around the internet. We strive to bring you all the breaking hockey news as it happens.
The home page allows you to see the latest postings from every blog on the site. Subscribe here. For general inquiries and more, please contact us anytime.
Get the top online sports betting bonuses available to sports betters!
When learning from experts it’s best to learn personally from them, or from their blog. We can provide that with poker lessons blog, your home to learn poker personally.
Do you get shocked from the luck in the game of poker? Stop getting shocked and start being a Poker Shoker.
As well as reading about hockey games, you can also find info about poker like which poker sites accept American Express or which are the best Canadian poker sites and also find the top rakeback sites at rakeback.net.
Kukla’s Korner is always a free service for readers, but it costs some money to maintain. If you’re ever in a position to donate a few dollars to help out, we’d be very appreciative.
I think what gets overlooked here is his endurance. In his first Cup run in 07-08, he only played 35 games and that was heading into the playoffs. In 08-09, he played more games but you have to remember his “lower body” issues kept him out of the mid-season games for what was roughly 6 weeks of minimal duty. Last season was his 1st on 3 years that his most troubling issue was a broken finger (which is huge for goalies). I don’t think he was handled well at all through that and we all saw the ensuing disaster. I think he would have been “fresher” had he been rested through those few weeks, and we would have probably seen a different goalie. Even then, nothing would have saved some of the lackadaisical efforts seen elsewhere in the playoffs.
Posted by OneSmugPug on 09/08/10 at 10:17 AM ET